so.

i was cutting and pasting dimensions today; and went to go and change some
of the names of dimensions and levels-- nothnig too complicated.

I went to go and change the name of the physical dimension that a virtual
dimension is based off of

AND THE SERVICE CRASHES; AND IT'S ALL HOSED; AND NOW I LOOK AWFUL

WTF IS MICROSOFT DOING TO CONTINUE TESTING SQL SERVER 2000?

WHY CANT MICROSOFT STILL SUPPORT THEIR MOST POPULAR DATABASE FEATURE?

WHAT IS MICROSOFT DOING FOR SQL SERVER 2000 CUSTOMERS TODAY?

I just think that Microsoft is dropping the ball on 2000 because they're so
focused on 2005.

Take this upgrade and shove it Microsoft

FIX WHAT IS ON THE MARKET TODAY!!!

Aaron - of course we fully support SQL Server/Analysis Services 2000, and
will continue so even after SQL Server 2005 ships. I suggest that you open a
case with PSS, who will work with you to address this issue.

--
==================================================
Mosha Pasumansky - http://www.mosha.com/msolap
Analysis Services blog at http://www.sqljunkies.com/WebLog/mosha
Development Lead in the Analysis Server team
All you need is love (John Lennon)
Disclaimer : This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and
confers no rights.
==================================================
<aaron_kempf (AT) hotmail (DOT) com> wrote

Mosha;

I love your website-- a LOT... and i appreciate your help.

But you guys can't honestly believe that this Analysis Manager is bugfree.
It is barely usable.

I just want to know why you guys ship products without testing.

I want to know why you guys can't fix bugs. I want to know why you guys
don't stumble into these sort of usability issusses.. You guys don't TEST
YOUR PRODUCTS ENOUGH. Use them in real-world scenarios... You see-- us, the
real developers that have to use Analysis Services-- we have been abused by
the quality of your products. I love olap more than anything-- but it is
too buggy to use.

GET THIS;

A WHEN YOU CHANGE A DATASOURCE, IT DOESN'T CHANGE THE LABEL. IN ANALYSIS
MANAGER. YOU SETUP A CUBE BASED ON A SERVER NAMED HOXOOCAARKEM AND THEN YOU
GO TO CHANGE IT TO PRODSQL1-- THE LABEL DOESN'T CHANGE. The datasource was
changed to point to PRODSQL1, but the label still says 'HOXOOCAARKEM'. I've
bitched about this in a hundred different places; and never heard a REASON
that Microsoft can't grace us with a product that works.

That is called abusing developers, Mosha. You have just been convicted.

GET THIS FIXED 3 YEARS AGO MOSHA

WHATEVER HAPPENED TO THE QUALITY OF YOUR PRODUCTS?

I love OLAP and SQL Server more than anything else in the world-- i just
think that you guys are letting your guard down; and I wish that you guys
would start taking this seriously. MY CAREER IS TIED TO YOUR QUALITY DB
PRODUCTS AND YOU GUYS AREN'T TAKING THIS SERIOUSLY.

B Can't you make a driver that won't let itself get overwritten?? Can't
you include OLAP drivers via Windows Update, or something??? I've had
problems with OWC and OLAP drivers since day 1. Upgrading 50k desktops to
Office 2003 isn't an option. How many hours do each of _US_ spend; running
around installing drivers? OLAP drivers are buggy as hell-- and I can't
wait for _SOMETHING_ to be able to fix this. OWC is a dream come true-- but
it is almost impossible to implement; because there is always some manager
somewhere that has a copy of Visio 2000 that overwrites some driver or
something. Its like-- I have thie client-- Safeco-- where someone installed
Analysis Manager on top of XP SP2; and they couldnt' connect to cubes via
OWC. Is it a driver problem, is it a OWC problem?

Why is it that you guys can't create a stand-alone client.. Where if someone
needs AM on thier machine, they could just run the AM install; instead of
needing to run AM install and then SQL AS SP3-- that is just a joke. Make
one installer; that installs the products-- instead of having to confuse
developers.

B.5) You guys need to start allowig OWC downloads in one place:
www.microsoft.com/owc You can't drop XP downloads of OWC just because you
want to sell 2003. I HONESTLY can't find the download anywhere. I finally
found the correct version via Office XP SP3-- but I don't think that an
end-user could do that. It's not OUR fault that you guys are greedy and are
coming out with too many versions of Office. But Office 2002 isn't 2 years
old; and you guys aren't supporting it basically.

C). I DEMAND-- I DEMAND-- THE ABILITY TO USE OLAP IN ACCESS REPORTS. RS
ISN'T SOLVING PROBLEMS. RS SUCKS. ALLOW ACCESS MDB AND ADP TO CONSUME MD
DATASETS. Make some wizards for doing it, or somethign. an add-in..
anything.

D). ARE THERE _REALLY_ SYNTAX DIFFERENCES BETWEEN MDX IN RS AND MDX VIA 'Mdx
Sample Application'. I swear; I've seen MDX work in MDX sample application;
but not in RS-- Is this true, Why is it true; and why do you guys put up
with this??

E). Can't you make SQL2005 able to browse SQL2000 cubes? WE DESERVE A DECENT
IDE FOR WRITING MDX

F). WHAT IS UP WITH ACCESS ADP? SOMEONE SAID IT IS BEING DEPECRATED-- IT IS
BUGGY AS HELL. TRY THIS:
1. create proc in Query Analyzer using the 'create proc spHappy as
select * FROM sysobjbects
2. open this proc via ADP and edit this to say 'select * FROM
sysobjects where name like 'sys%'
3. save the proc. 'The parameter is incorrect'

I'VE BEEN SCREAMING BLOODY MURDER ABOUT THIS FOR A YEAR. ADP IS A SERIOUS
PLATFORM-- IT IS VERY POWERFUL. THIS IS WHERE BEANCOUNTERS SHOULD BE
WRITING THEIR REPORTS-- INSTEAD OF IN EXCEL--GAG---

AND SOMEHOW YOU GUYS ARE TOO BUSY, WORKING ON OFFICE 12-- DOES THE MADNESS
NEVER STOP???????????????????????????????????????

DO WE REALLY NEED A NEW VERSION OF OFFICE EVERY 18 MONTHS?

INNOVATE. FIX BUGS. FIX ALL BUGS IN SQL, ACCESS AND OLAP. BEFORE YOU SHIP
SQL 2005.

MAKE ACCESS DATA PROJECTS WORK AGAINST SQL 2005. MAKE RS ABLE TO CONSUME
ADP REPORTS. TEST IT IN A HUNDRED DIFFERENT CONFIGURATIONS


I AM NOT YOUR BETA TESTER.

I AM NOT YOUR SLAVE.

START OFFERING SERIOUS PRODUCTS OR I TAKE ALL MY CLIENTS TO ORACLE OR IBM.

AND GET THIS

FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION IN SQL2000. FIX IT RIGHT NOW. PROTECT IT. SECURE IT.
WINDOWS AUTHENTICATION _SUX_ FOR A LOT OF THINGS; AND I AM SICK AND TIRED OF
NOT HAVING A DECENT, SECURE WAY TO GET TO MY DATA.

FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION
FIX SQL AUTHENTICATION




"Mosha Pasumansky [MS]" <moshap (AT) online (DOT) microsoft.com> wrote

Aaron, I tried to address your comments below:

We don't beleive it is absolutely bug free. But I disagree with your
assertion that it is barely usable.

I think it is unfair to say that we ship products without testing. I agree,
that perhaps some areas are not tested enough. However we can and do fix
bugs - either in service packs (BTW Beta of SP4 is about to come out) or
out-of-band as hotfixes.

We now have special team inside SQL BI organization, which has single
purpose - use BI products in the real-world scenarios. This team is
different from the test organization in a sense that it doesn't test
specific features - it uses the product the way customers would use it and
see whether it works as a whole. I think this is exactly what you are
refering to.

I agree that this is very annoying. The reason is that design of DSO and
repository schema fundamentally doesn't allow object renaming, because names
are used as keys. So it is not really possible to fix in AS2K. In AS2005
however, we introduced to every object name and id - and name can change as
many times as you want, because id is the real key.

I feel your pain - and I do want to assure you, that we are not letting the
guard down, and we do take the quality of the products seriously. What you
described above, however, is not a product defect, but rather design
limitation, which, while annoying, doesn't take away functionality, i.e. you
can change the datasource, just not its name.

We cannot put msolap80.dll to the Windows Update, because it is not part of
Windows. However we do make both ptslite.exe and ptsfull.exe freely
available on microsoft.com, and they are there exactly for this purpose -
being able to distrubute OLAP drivers without installing Office 2003.

I am not sure I got this point: Do you suggest that we produce new setup
which will install SP4 directly, instead of first running RTM version of
setup and then applying SP4 on top of it ?

I have forwarded your feedback to the Office team.

Sorry, I don't know what ADP is. Alternative solution to "RS SUCKS" problem
would be to fix RS. Perhaps you can tell us what are the problems with RS
and we will see how they can be addressed. I suggest you do it in a separate
post and copy microsoft.public.sqlserver.reportingsvcs newsgroup as well.

There are no syntax differences in MDX between MDX Sample application and
RS, but there is a difference in a way those two application request a
result. MDX Sample works with MDDataSet, while RS requests flattened rowset.
So the same MDX statement should work in both, just the way the results look
will be different. It is possible, that if you put too many members on
COLUMNS axis, RS is not able to deal with it though.

Well, the AS2005 OLAP driver is able to connect and work against AS2K cubes,
so I interpret your question as making AS2005 IDEs to connect and manage
AS2K cubes. For BI Development Studio this would be close to impossible to
do, since it relies on new Yukon DDL for metadata operations which isn't
available in AS2K

Again, I don't know what ADP is, but I assume that this is something in
Access. You probably need to tell about those bugs in Access newsgroup.

Not sure what this refers to. Are you saying that there is a problem with
SQL Authentication in SQL Server 2000, or are you saying that it is a
problem that Analyisis Services only supports Windows Authentication ?

Thanks,
Mosha.

--
==================================================
Mosha Pasumansky - http://www.mosha.com/msolap
Analysis Services blog at http://www.sqljunkies.com/WebLog/mosha
Development Lead in the Analysis Server team
All you need is love (John Lennon)
Disclaimer : This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and
confers no rights.
==================================================

SQL authentication doesn't work for SQL Server to anywhere. it just isn't
functional-- because it isn't secure.

it isn't secure-- people chew me out for wanting to use it. this product
has been out 4 years.. can't you fix it??

i just wish that you guys woudl fix it-- make it so that it is secure.

i've worked in a lot of environs-- like novell-- and SQL authentication is
just SOOOOOO Much easier to use than NT authentication.



ADP (access data projects) are the best product that MS has ever put out..
I've developed dozens of them.. And it is _REALLY_ buggy.

It is basically a way for access developers to start writing all of their
queries on the SQL side.. it is very important.. and it is very powerful.

I swear that every beancounter in the world should be developing their
reports in ADP; but somehow it's not getting traction.

I swear the product is buggy-- i have a whole list-- but it's like they're
not taking me seriously.

i've worked with as400/RPG developers; and I've seen the pain that they go
thru in order to create forms and reports against a database. that's all im
talking about.. a simple platform for Small and Medium Businesses to enter
data into a database. It is maybe scalable enoug to go to 50 or 100 users;
and it is fast (if written correctly)

ADP is that same market. It is critically important. Just a simple
mechanism for getting data into the database (bound SQL Server platform) and
pulling it out via reporting.

it is about 10x more powerful than reporting services.. but it is really
buggy.. and i'm tired of hearing excuses about why it is buggy; and when it
is getting fixed.

I can't get anyone in the Office dept to fix problems i find.. and I've
encountered the create proc bug every day. My co-workers make sprocs using
the create proc syntax.. and it just craps out on me when i go to use it in
ADP.

It's like-- if i create proc with create proc or create procedure-- it
should work either way.

I just love usign ADP for reporting; and it breaks my heart that you guys
aren't taking it seriously-- i assume that is because you guys think that RS
is going to replace Access Reporting.. and I dont' know if that is going to
happen.




"Mosha Pasumansky [MS]" <moshap (AT) online (DOT) microsoft.com> wrote

the most important part about ADP is that the tools in an Access Data
Proejct are better for writing stored procedures and SQL udfs.

_THAT_ is what this is all about... ADP is more powerful than other tools
for writing sprocs.
it's like-- i haven't seen the same functionality anywhere.

you can open a portion of a sproc in design view-- you can take a subquery
and open it in design view.. and this has been a part of office for _YEARS_
and nobody uses it because it's so buggy.

There is definitely a need for this application. Access isn't ever 'just
going to go away'. Just like Excel isn't going to go away.
So start taking it seriously.

A lot of us got our starts in Access... The default repository in AS 2000 is
MDB. I wrote MDB with forms and reports for 2 years before getting into
SQL Server.. I was able to get into SQL Server, because of my background in
Access. I was able to become a SQL Server developer today-- solely
because I fell in love with ADP 4 years ago... and with every release of
Office, you guys just break my heart.

I _know_ that ADP and DAP must be a really big money pit-- but the
alternative-- where your customers are heading-- is a much more dangerous
path.

I see hundreds of spreadsheets every where I go. I see hundreds of
spreadsheet developers-- and the problem is a marketing problem with
Access.. Marketing-- because you guys won't come out and lay out a roadmap
for Access that goes 10 years down the road.. And start responding to
complaints about bugs and stuff.. I mean-- the usability of Access has gone
DOWN in the past few years.

Some _LOSER_ decided that it was ok to prompt end-users a half-dozen times
to run macros in Access. That isn't acceptable. Excel Macros are just as
much of a theat as Access Macros-- Excel only prompts you ONCE about macros,
but Access prompts you once for the 'Jet Sp8 bs' and once for 'are you surce
you want to run this, it has macros; it could be dangerous.

Isnt' this the same warning??

Can't you guys get a clue and start being CONSIDERATE of access; and respect
the Access development community?

I know you're going to laugh-- but Access is on the path to SQL Server; and
Excel geeks are _NEVER_ going to get into SQL Server.. Us DB Developers are
overworked as it is...
Every beancounter in the world should be writing reports in ADP instead of
Access. Crystal Reports has a 20% market share.

Reporting Services doesn't compete with Crystal Reports. RS competes with
Crystal Enterprise. All we need is the ability to make canned reports--
that we can print and customize-- using VBA.

We need to be able to control the layout of a report.. create them
programmatically.. We need to be able to refer to controls on different
levels-- in Access; it is easy to calculate a percentage of group--- or
whatever kind of calculation you want. RS and SQL 2000-- they're just not
as powerful as Access MDB has been for the past 8 years.. Microsoft SQL 2000
doesn't have a LOT of the features that were present in Access 95 and 97..

And insteead of fixing the problems in the current version of Access; now
you're trying to sell us on this infopath/sharepoint BS.

Cut the crap and start taking Access seriously.

Access is more powerful than TSQL-- the Crosstab Query-- i mean SQL 2005 is
finally competing with MDB...

And VB.net 2005 _might_ be good enough to compete with Access forms--

there is a saying (among us Access Developers) that if something takes me 1
hour to write in Access, it would take a 'normal vb developer' 3 hours to
write; and 4 hours to write in ASP/ASP.net.

It's a statistic, a motto and a way of life.

Access is the best platform in the world for doing simple data entry and
reporting tasks.

It is a seperate product than SQL2000-- I understand this.

but they're not responding; and I don't care who needs to do what-- I need
to hear a 'Yes, Sir' when I tell you that Create Proc bug is going to drive
someone crazy someday.

I mean-- 'Create Proc SpHappy as select * FROM sysobjects'

Open it in ADP; change it in design view; and then save the changes.

'The parameter is incorrect'--- What kindof error message is that????

Create Proc Procname is listed in SQL Books Online.. can't we _please_ make
it work correctly with ADP sprocs??

We woudl all love to get rid of _everythign_ and start fresh with SQL
Reporting Services.. But with the way that you guys introduce new products
every 6 months; and you drop existing products..
I just feel like you guys aren't supporting your most important products at
a time when you need to be doing this.

Reporting Services doesn't suck.. I am sorry for saying that.. It is just
obnoxiously difficult to get used to..

I've never seen .net outside of Redmond.. and it's difficult for Microsoft
to convince me to run out and learn a new language every 2 years.

It isn't on my agenda-- I have code to write; not code to learn.

And I really wish that you guys had come out with a more polished product in
RS 2000. I swear I've had problems where I save reports; and the save isn't
committed. I swear, the OLAP debugger-- you guys _have_ to be able to do
something about it's ability to debug MDX statements.. in SQL 2000.

I swear, I've had hangs and crashes with VS2003-- I lock my PC and come back
from lunch and VS2003 is hung.. It worked before hand; it's not workign
now.. It's just not production ready..

And I wish that maybe things would have been different these past few
years...

All I know is that this nightmare that i'm having today.. it looks an awful
lot like the same nightmare that I had in 1999--- people use spreadsheets
too much; and there is a stigma -- even within Microsoft-- that Excel is the
right platform for _everything_ to be written in.

I've seen spreadsheet problems soo complex that they make me sick.

Do you know how much more fun this OLAP game would be if every beancounter
were writing MDB (or ADP) reports and tables instead of in XLS?

I mean-- It is SOOOOOOOOOOO inefficient to have meeting notes in a xls; and
schedules in an XLS and goals and all of this-- in an XLS.

And i think that there is a problem that Microsoft isn't recognizing-- I
think that Microsoft isn't responding to complaints about USABILITY issues
for Access.. that woudl surely drive one crazy.

I'm about at that point, if I get that prompt ONE MORE TIME i swear... and
the reason that you guys won't fix it is:

a) the marketing problem regarding Access is WORSE even with Microsoft
b) beancounters rule the roost at Microsoft-- so some PM sneers-- 'why do we
even MAKE access anymore'
c) because you're too busy working on Access 12 to fix problems that have
been around since Office 2000.

Spreadsheets are a disease-- a one-way street for data to get buried in
formatting and formulas...

You guys aren't responding to this problem because you guys have a marketing
problem with Access.

i'm just frustrated; since my co-workers always use the crate proc syntax..
and i always have to recreate sprocs using the create procedure syntax..

it's just kinda ridiculous..

and i can't get anyone on the access side to admit it's annoying.. it's
like-- totally impossible to convince them.

I shouldn't have to convince them-- they should say 'yes sir, we will fix
that right now, thank you'.

i just don't appreciate the attitude i've seen.. it's like you guys are
willing to accept bugs.. and I say that MS is big enough and successful
enough that they can raise the bar a little bit..

if a label doesn't update; then you should hide the label-- call it
connection1 and connection2 if you must..

I'm just frustrated that things aren't moving faster on the SQL2000 front;
and I see soooooo many people having problems with OLAP patches and
drivers.. and i'm like-- it's simpler than this guys.. if something is
wrong, bitch about it until it gets fixed.

well here i am; saying that you have problems-- where SQL is barely
useable.. because of security concerns.

SQL authentication is a REQUIREMENT, not an afterthought. We shouldn't have
to change our domains just because you guys decide to make 'NT
Authentication' the _preferred_ way to do things in SQL 2000????

Well, that ISN'T ACCEPTABLE. TRY GIVING ME A DIFFERENT ANSWER.

That doesn't mean that you can accept SQL authentication like it has been.

Make wizards for protecting against dictionary attacks in SQL Server 2000.
Make it so that we can add a certificate to a SQL login; and then we dont'
have to use Windows authentication _or_ drop our shields.

Make your existing products easier to use, less buggy, more reliable.. and
more secure.

The product isnt' finished when it ships out the door.

I have seen problem after problem after problem with SQL Server.. and a lot
of times; I have problems with NT authentication.

A lot of times, my SQL JOB FAILS because some lame Windows Admin is
rebooting some server or upgrading hard drives and my SQL jobs fail because
of it.

That is when NT authentication proves that it isn't reliable enough to get
the job done.

I just know that you guys have the resources to start fixing problems; and
to improve your attitude-- take an attitude that you are going to get these
products to ZERO BUGCOUNT because you have the _ABILITY_ to do it.

Raise the bar.

Don't accept mediocrity.

And when something is broken; fix it.

-aaron




"Mosha Pasumansky [MS]" <moshap (AT) online (DOT) microsoft.com> wrote