Getting UniQuery to cough its internals up

#1

I posted this to u2users (google) group without getting a response - so
I'll try here...

michael (AT) preece (DOT) net wrote:

Quote:

Hi

What I'm looking for is a way to build a new table based on the output
generated by a UniQuery LIST command. What I'd like is for the output
generated by the LIST comand to be of infinite width and depth, and
then be able to parse that output, generating records to write to a
file.

I'd like to be able to issue a LIST command with any and all of the
selection criteria, sort criteria, formatting options - BY-EXPs,
BREAK-ONs, the lot - and get back a new table.

I have a partially completed subroutine. The arguments passed to it are
:-
1) The LIST command
2) The name of a destination file
3) The "Form", or normalisation, option
4) An Overwrite/Don't overwrite switch
and the arguments returned are :-
5) Error codes
6) Error messages

If the "Form" option is passed as "1NF", then each line generated by
the LIST statement will become a new record in the destination file,
and will be keyed on a sequential number beginning with 1. Each row, or
record, will derive from a line generated by the LIST statement, with
an attribute for each column, and each and every attribute will be
populated. Where the LIST statement produced lines with blanks in
columns for single attributes with multiple associated multivalues - or
for multivalues with multiple associated subvalues - then, when I'm
parsing the output to create the new records, I'll be using the last
non-blank value in a column to populate the attribute for that column
in subsequent records.

The other option for "Form" will be "NNF". In that case, repeated
values will be removed, and up to 126 levels of nesting can occur, with
each attribute being delimited by char(253), and within that by
char(252)... and so on down to char(128). In this case, where a column
contains a repeat occurrence, and all columns to the left of it were
either blank or the same as the last non-blank value in that column in
previous lines, the value will be removed (that is to say - it will me
interpreted as being redundant).

Key to being able to do this is to allow the LIST statement to generate
the widest possible "page" of output, and also to be able to
efficiently handle the output. Have you any advice on how I could go
beyond setting the printer page width to 256 characters and the page
depth to infinity (TERM ,,256,0)? Or maybe you can suggest a better way
than PERFORM...CAPTURING... to get hold of the LIST output so as to
begin parsing it.

TIA,
Mike.

The silence in here is deafening. This (u2users google group) really
could be a useful group you know - all it takes is active
participation. Don't be shy...

As you can probably tell, I am not "at home" with UniData yet - apart
from UniBasic - having spent most of my time with the Pick/Reality side
of the MV family.

I got a bit further with what I was attempting. I worked out that I
needed to set the TERMinal width to 1024 (the maximum width allowed)
and depth to 0 (infinity) - nothing to do with the printer.

Before EXECUTEing the SORT.COMMAND I executed a "COMO ON myfilename
HUSH" - and a "COMO myfilename OFF" afterwards.

So now I have the SORT.COMMAND that was used to generate the
intermediate stage data - which I have in the _PH_ O_myfilename ASCII
sequential file.

The problem I'm up against now is that I'd like to be able to map the
SORT.COMMAND to the output it generated - in order to begin parsing the
data.

It's weighing on my mind that I'm having to reinvent a wheel here - and
one that I've just turned at that. The UniQuery processor must have
constructed exactly what I'm after somewhere along the way. What would
be excellent is if there was some option or something that will get
UniQuery to cough up its internals, so to speak, and show its internal
metadata for what the columns are, what their widths are, whether
they're left or right justified, what output conversion was applied to
each column - and anything else I might be able to use.

Please - someone tell me this is possible. I have seen something
similar to what I'm after with D3's Access Query Language. Is D3 - as I
have come to believe - just that much more developer-friendly and
advanced than IBM's UniData?

Mike.

#2

Probably.

D3 alows you to modify the SORT and LIST commands to insert TAB between
each field, otherwise you'll have to parse the lines yourself.

Maybe what you are thinking of is the REFORMAT command

Mark Brown

Quote:

Please - someone tell me this is possible. I have seen something
similar to what I'm after with D3's Access Query Language. Is D3 - as I
have come to believe - just that much more developer-friendly and
advanced than IBM's UniData?

Mike.

#3

Mike Preece wrote:

Quote:

I posted this to u2users (google) group without getting a response - so
I'll try here...

michael (AT) preece (DOT) net wrote:

Hi

What I'm looking for is a way to build a new table based on the output
generated by a UniQuery LIST command. What I'd like is for the output
generated by the LIST comand to be of infinite width and depth, and
then be able to parse that output, generating records to write to a
file.

I'd like to be able to issue a LIST command with any and all of the
selection criteria, sort criteria, formatting options - BY-EXPs,
BREAK-ONs, the lot - and get back a new table.

I have a partially completed subroutine. The arguments passed to it are
:-
1) The LIST command
2) The name of a destination file
3) The "Form", or normalisation, option
4) An Overwrite/Don't overwrite switch
and the arguments returned are :-
5) Error codes
6) Error messages

If the "Form" option is passed as "1NF", then each line generated by
the LIST statement will become a new record in the destination file,
and will be keyed on a sequential number beginning with 1. Each row, or
record, will derive from a line generated by the LIST statement, with
an attribute for each column, and each and every attribute will be
populated. Where the LIST statement produced lines with blanks in
columns for single attributes with multiple associated multivalues - or
for multivalues with multiple associated subvalues - then, when I'm
parsing the output to create the new records, I'll be using the last
non-blank value in a column to populate the attribute for that column
in subsequent records.

The other option for "Form" will be "NNF". In that case, repeated
values will be removed, and up to 126 levels of nesting can occur, with
each attribute being delimited by char(253), and within that by
char(252)... and so on down to char(128). In this case, where a column
contains a repeat occurrence, and all columns to the left of it were
either blank or the same as the last non-blank value in that column in
previous lines, the value will be removed (that is to say - it will me
interpreted as being redundant).

Key to being able to do this is to allow the LIST statement to generate
the widest possible "page" of output, and also to be able to
efficiently handle the output. Have you any advice on how I could go
beyond setting the printer page width to 256 characters and the page
depth to infinity (TERM ,,256,0)? Or maybe you can suggest a better way
than PERFORM...CAPTURING... to get hold of the LIST output so as to
begin parsing it.

TIA,
Mike.

The silence in here is deafening. This (u2users google group) really
could be a useful group you know - all it takes is active
participation. Don't be shy...

As you can probably tell, I am not "at home" with UniData yet - apart
from UniBasic - having spent most of my time with the Pick/Reality side
of the MV family.

I got a bit further with what I was attempting. I worked out that I
needed to set the TERMinal width to 1024 (the maximum width allowed)
and depth to 0 (infinity) - nothing to do with the printer.

Before EXECUTEing the SORT.COMMAND I executed a "COMO ON myfilename
HUSH" - and a "COMO myfilename OFF" afterwards.

So now I have the SORT.COMMAND that was used to generate the
intermediate stage data - which I have in the _PH_ O_myfilename ASCII
sequential file.

The problem I'm up against now is that I'd like to be able to map the
SORT.COMMAND to the output it generated - in order to begin parsing the
data.

It's weighing on my mind that I'm having to reinvent a wheel here - and
one that I've just turned at that. The UniQuery processor must have
constructed exactly what I'm after somewhere along the way. What would
be excellent is if there was some option or something that will get
UniQuery to cough up its internals, so to speak, and show its internal
metadata for what the columns are, what their widths are, whether
they're left or right justified, what output conversion was applied to
each column - and anything else I might be able to use.

Please - someone tell me this is possible. I have seen something
similar to what I'm after with D3's Access Query Language. Is D3 - as I
have come to believe - just that much more developer-friendly and
advanced than IBM's UniData?

Mike.

It would be nice to know if there's anything available re: the above -
but meanwhile, in case anyone's interested, I'm heading down the
SORT...TOXML route, as in :-

SORT TMS.TASK CREATE.DATE MINUTES.SPENT TOXML
Validate XML name changed name from '@ID' to '_ID'
<?xml version="1.0"?>
<ROOT>
<TMS.TASK_record _ID = "1" CREATE.DATE = "01 DEC 2005">
<TIME.INFO_MV MINUTES.SPENT = "20"/>
<TIME.INFO_MV MINUTES.SPENT = "120"/>
<TIME.INFO_MV MINUTES.SPENT = "45"/>
</TMS.TASK_record>
<TMS.TASK_record _ID = "2" CREATE.DATE = "11 DEC 2005">
<TIME.INFO_MV MINUTES.SPENT = "120"/>
<TIME.INFO_MV MINUTES.SPENT = "120"/>
<TIME.INFO_MV MINUTES.SPENT = "120"/>
</TMS.TASK_record>
</ROOT>

SORT TMS.TASK CREATE.DATE MINUTES.SPENT TOXML ELEMENTS
Validate XML name changed name from '@ID' to '_ID'
<?xml version="1.0"?>
<ROOT>
<TMS.TASK_record>
<_ID>1</_ID>
<CREATE.DATE>01 DEC 2005</CREATE.DATE>
<TIME.INFO_MV>
<MINUTES.SPENT>20</MINUTES.SPENT>
</TIME.INFO_MV>
<TIME.INFO_MV>
<MINUTES.SPENT>120</MINUTES.SPENT>
</TIME.INFO_MV>
<TIME.INFO_MV>
<MINUTES.SPENT>45</MINUTES.SPENT>
</TIME.INFO_MV>
</TMS.TASK_record>
<TMS.TASK_record>
<_ID>2</_ID>
<CREATE.DATE>11 DEC 2005</CREATE.DATE>
<TIME.INFO_MV>
<MINUTES.SPENT>120</MINUTES.SPENT>
</TIME.INFO_MV>
<TIME.INFO_MV>
<MINUTES.SPENT>120</MINUTES.SPENT>
</TIME.INFO_MV>
<TIME.INFO_MV>
<MINUTES.SPENT>120</MINUTES.SPENT>
</TIME.INFO_MV>
</TMS.TASK_record>
</ROOT>

....which is easier to work with than the output from a normal UniQuery
listing.

Mike.

#4

Mike Preece wrote:

Quote:

I posted this to u2users (google) group without getting a response - so
I'll try here...

michael (AT) preece (DOT) net wrote:

Hi

What I'm looking for is a way to build a new table based on the output
generated by a UniQuery LIST command. What I'd like is for the output
generated by the LIST comand to be of infinite width and depth, and
then be able to parse that output, generating records to write to a
file.

Have you looked at the REFORMAT command? Otherwise perhaps (but
unlikely) what you want to do is doable with Cedarville DOWNLOAD. I
read through it and didn't fully comprehend, so these suggestions might
not be helpful at all.

Quote:

I'd like to be able to issue a LIST command with any and all of the
selection criteria, sort criteria, formatting options - BY-EXPs,
BREAK-ONs, the lot - and get back a new table.

I have a partially completed subroutine. The arguments passed to it are
:-
1) The LIST command
2) The name of a destination file
3) The "Form", or normalisation, option
4) An Overwrite/Don't overwrite switch
and the arguments returned are :-
5) Error codes
6) Error messages

If the "Form" option is passed as "1NF", then each line generated by
the LIST statement will become a new record in the destination file,
and will be keyed on a sequential number beginning with 1. Each row, or
record, will derive from a line generated by the LIST statement, with
an attribute for each column, and each and every attribute will be
populated. Where the LIST statement produced lines with blanks in
columns for single attributes with multiple associated multivalues - or
for multivalues with multiple associated subvalues - then, when I'm
parsing the output to create the new records, I'll be using the last
non-blank value in a column to populate the attribute for that column
in subsequent records.

The other option for "Form" will be "NNF". In that case, repeated
values will be removed, and up to 126 levels of nesting can occur, with
each attribute being delimited by char(253), and within that by
char(252)... and so on down to char(128). In this case, where a column
contains a repeat occurrence, and all columns to the left of it were
either blank or the same as the last non-blank value in that column in
previous lines, the value will be removed (that is to say - it will me
interpreted as being redundant).

Key to being able to do this is to allow the LIST statement to generate
the widest possible "page" of output, and also to be able to
efficiently handle the output. Have you any advice on how I could go
beyond setting the printer page width to 256 characters and the page
depth to infinity (TERM ,,256,0)? Or maybe you can suggest a better way
than PERFORM...CAPTURING... to get hold of the LIST output so as to
begin parsing it.

TIA,
Mike.

The silence in here is deafening. This (u2users google group) really
could be a useful group you know - all it takes is active
participation. Don't be shy...

I really do think it would be better to work with the U2UG to help
enhance u2-users so it provides the technical solutions you want in
order to participate in that community. It is a very well established
list. I would like to see it move to googlegroups too, but there
problems with every solution. I suggest you give u2-users another try
and see if you can get into the swing of it. Cheers! --dawn

#5

Mike, this suggestion comes from a friend who understands the pain,
not from a guy selling software: Take a look into mv.NET which does
everything you ask and so much more. Why do people insist so
passionately on spending so many hours to create something that
already exists? I don't know anyone here who grows their own coffee
beans but I know a lot of people here drink coffee. Why build parsers
when your real goal is to write reports?

From a community perspective, and now stepping into reseller shoes and
looking to collect some fud, I'll ask that you please keep track of
how much time you're spending on this, as a case study for exactly how
much investment you're making. It will be interesting to see if the
solution you come up with is of comparable value to the development
time.

To the specific problem, here's a hint: Try using Select statements
which return MV lists rather than trying to parse the formatted output
from a LIST.

"Mike Preece" wrote:

Quote:

I posted this to u2users (google) group without getting a response - so
I'll try here...

Regarding your post to the Google group: Respectfully my friend, the
only Google group that exists for U2/MV users is the one you created.
There are only 36 members there and you're mostly talking to yourself
in the few messages that have been posted - trees are falling and no
one is around to hear them. Hey, I understand the feeling from my own
unused website forums.

Do yourself a favor, delete the group and
take your requests to the u2users forum supported by U2UG.org. I'm
sure you'll get considered responses from a large and dedicated
community.

HTH
T

#6

Mike;

Lots of ways to skin this cat.

You've found TOXML. There's also TO DELIM. I use these frequently for the
"quick and dirty" stuff.

Others have mentioned: REFORMAT (pretty much the same as D3), MV.NET, and
DOWNLOAD from ftp://ftp.cedarville.edu/download/ - use this if you don't
want to re-invent this particular wheel. I would say this likely does what
you're looking for.

If you want to use "external" reporting tools then you can connect through
UniObjects, OLEdb, and ODBC. We setup an ODBC schema and made some pretty
fancy reports with Crystal. Of course, at that point you can use Access or
Excel as well. It may be a little more work on the "front-end" though.

There are tools that are UniData aware like: MITS, Informer, or Visage.Bit.

Not sure what you mean by the "internals". Everything that the UniQuery
processor uses is in the dict items. You can even use the ITYPE function to
"use" the actual dictionary item in code. Just seems to me that capturing
the output from a UniQuery statement and parsing it out with code is a
little bass-ackwards. If you really want to get convoluted you could do the
LIST TO DELIM and use a tool like parserat to pull it back apart.

I also came from D3. There are only a handful of things that I miss: the
online resizing; (U option on get-list; ability to access files in other
accounts using the acct,filename, syntax; where; and (rarely now) dumpgroup.
There's also a little more configuration than there was with D3.

When we migrated from D3 we had also pretty much just finished migrating
from Screen-Gen to SB+. Most of our code came over quite cleanly (once we
cleaned up everything so we could be case-sensitive). That was, by far, the
biggest hurdle. P.S. although it's possible to do a D3 account save to a
*nix file and then run a command to upper-case all of the characters in the
file and then restore into UniData I don't really recommend it.

Perhaps with a better idea of what you're trying to do, or how you would
have done it in D3, we can provide better answers.

hth
Colin Alfke
Calgary Canada
"Mike Preece" wrote

Quote:

Mike Preece wrote:

I posted this to u2users (google) group without getting a response - so
I'll try here...

michael preece net wrote:

Hi

What I'm looking for is a way to build a new table based on the output
generated by a UniQuery LIST command. What I'd like is for the output
generated by the LIST comand to be of infinite width and depth, and
then be able to parse that output, generating records to write to a
file.

I'd like to be able to issue a LIST command with any and all of the
selection criteria, sort criteria, formatting options - BY-EXPs,
BREAK-ONs, the lot - and get back a new table.

I have a partially completed subroutine. The arguments passed to it
are
:-
1) The LIST command
2) The name of a destination file
3) The "Form", or normalisation, option
4) An Overwrite/Don't overwrite switch
and the arguments returned are :-
5) Error codes
6) Error messages

If the "Form" option is passed as "1NF", then each line generated by
the LIST statement will become a new record in the destination file,
and will be keyed on a sequential number beginning with 1. Each row,
or
record, will derive from a line generated by the LIST statement, with
an attribute for each column, and each and every attribute will be
populated. Where the LIST statement produced lines with blanks in
columns for single attributes with multiple associated multivalues -
or
for multivalues with multiple associated subvalues - then, when I'm
parsing the output to create the new records, I'll be using the last
non-blank value in a column to populate the attribute for that column
in subsequent records.

The other option for "Form" will be "NNF". In that case, repeated
values will be removed, and up to 126 levels of nesting can occur,
with
each attribute being delimited by char(253), and within that by
char(252)... and so on down to char(128). In this case, where a column
contains a repeat occurrence, and all columns to the left of it were
either blank or the same as the last non-blank value in that column in
previous lines, the value will be removed (that is to say - it will me
interpreted as being redundant).

Key to being able to do this is to allow the LIST statement to
generate
the widest possible "page" of output, and also to be able to
efficiently handle the output. Have you any advice on how I could go
beyond setting the printer page width to 256 characters and the page
depth to infinity (TERM ,,256,0)? Or maybe you can suggest a better
way
than PERFORM...CAPTURING... to get hold of the LIST output so as to
begin parsing it.

TIA,
Mike.

The silence in here is deafening. This (u2users google group) really
could be a useful group you know - all it takes is active
participation. Don't be shy...

As you can probably tell, I am not "at home" with UniData yet - apart
from UniBasic - having spent most of my time with the Pick/Reality side
of the MV family.

I got a bit further with what I was attempting. I worked out that I
needed to set the TERMinal width to 1024 (the maximum width allowed)
and depth to 0 (infinity) - nothing to do with the printer.

Before EXECUTEing the SORT.COMMAND I executed a "COMO ON myfilename
HUSH" - and a "COMO myfilename OFF" afterwards.

So now I have the SORT.COMMAND that was used to generate the
intermediate stage data - which I have in the _PH_ O_myfilename ASCII
sequential file.

The problem I'm up against now is that I'd like to be able to map the
SORT.COMMAND to the output it generated - in order to begin parsing the
data.

It's weighing on my mind that I'm having to reinvent a wheel here - and
one that I've just turned at that. The UniQuery processor must have
constructed exactly what I'm after somewhere along the way. What would
be excellent is if there was some option or something that will get
UniQuery to cough up its internals, so to speak, and show its internal
metadata for what the columns are, what their widths are, whether
they're left or right justified, what output conversion was applied to
each column - and anything else I might be able to use.

Please - someone tell me this is possible. I have seen something
similar to what I'm after with D3's Access Query Language. Is D3 - as I
have come to believe - just that much more developer-friendly and
advanced than IBM's UniData?

Mike.

It would be nice to know if there's anything available re: the above -
but meanwhile, in case anyone's interested, I'm heading down the
SORT...TOXML route, as in :-

SORT TMS.TASK CREATE.DATE MINUTES.SPENT TOXML
Validate XML name changed name from '@ID' to '_ID'
?xml version="1.0"?
ROOT
TMS.TASK_record _ID = "1" CREATE.DATE = "01 DEC 2005"
TIME.INFO_MV MINUTES.SPENT = "20"/
TIME.INFO_MV MINUTES.SPENT = "120"/
TIME.INFO_MV MINUTES.SPENT = "45"/
/TMS.TASK_record
TMS.TASK_record _ID = "2" CREATE.DATE = "11 DEC 2005"
TIME.INFO_MV MINUTES.SPENT = "120"/
TIME.INFO_MV MINUTES.SPENT = "120"/
TIME.INFO_MV MINUTES.SPENT = "120"/
/TMS.TASK_record
/ROOT

SORT TMS.TASK CREATE.DATE MINUTES.SPENT TOXML ELEMENTS
Validate XML name changed name from '@ID' to '_ID'
?xml version="1.0"?
ROOT
TMS.TASK_record
_ID>1</_ID
CREATE.DATE>01 DEC 2005</CREATE.DATE
TIME.INFO_MV
MINUTES.SPENT>20</MINUTES.SPENT
/TIME.INFO_MV
TIME.INFO_MV
MINUTES.SPENT>120</MINUTES.SPENT
/TIME.INFO_MV
TIME.INFO_MV
MINUTES.SPENT>45</MINUTES.SPENT
/TIME.INFO_MV
/TMS.TASK_record
TMS.TASK_record
_ID>2</_ID
CREATE.DATE>11 DEC 2005</CREATE.DATE
TIME.INFO_MV
MINUTES.SPENT>120</MINUTES.SPENT
/TIME.INFO_MV
TIME.INFO_MV
MINUTES.SPENT>120</MINUTES.SPENT
/TIME.INFO_MV
TIME.INFO_MV
MINUTES.SPENT>120</MINUTES.SPENT
/TIME.INFO_MV
/TMS.TASK_record
/ROOT

...which is easier to work with than the output from a normal UniQuery
listing.

Mike.

#7

Mike Preece wrote:
[snip]

Quote:

...What I'd like is for the output generated by the LIST
comand [sic] to be of infinite width and depth...
________________________^^^^^^^^

You're going to have a problem with disk space. =`:^>

Happy New Year to cdp, and all its lurkers/posters!

--
frosty

#8

Tony Gravagno wrote:

[snip]

Quote:

Regarding your post to the Google group: Respectfully my friend, the
only Google group that exists for U2/MV users is the one you created.
There are only 36 members there and you're mostly talking to yourself
in the few messages that have been posted - trees are falling and no
one is around to hear them. Hey, I understand the feeling from my own
unused website forums.

Do yourself a favor, delete the group and
take your requests to the u2users forum supported by U2UG.org. I'm
sure you'll get considered responses from a large and dedicated
community.

HTH
T

There's one thing and one thing only wrong with the u2users google
group : no one participates.

There's one thing and one thing only that the Oliver list has to its
advantage : many people participate.

The u2ug forums are somewhere between the two.

If you want to dig your heels in and refuse to go there - then that's
up to you. Stay away if you want to. I really don't see what useful
purpose you're serving though by advising me to shut it down, or
implying it's a waste of time and that, therefore, others should also
not participate. It's unhelpful and unconstructive criticism. Bud.

Mike.

#9

On 4 Jan 2006 18:11:42 -0800, "Mike Preece" <michael (AT) preece (DOT) net>
wrote:

Quote:

Tony Gravagno wrote:

[snip]

Regarding your post to the Google group: Respectfully my friend, the
only Google group that exists for U2/MV users is the one you created.
There are only 36 members there and you're mostly talking to yourself
in the few messages that have been posted - trees are falling and no
one is around to hear them. Hey, I understand the feeling from my own
unused website forums.

Do yourself a favor, delete the group and
take your requests to the u2users forum supported by U2UG.org. I'm
sure you'll get considered responses from a large and dedicated
community.

HTH
T

There's one thing and one thing only wrong with the u2users google
group : no one participates.

There's one thing and one thing only that the Oliver list has to its
advantage : many people participate.

Errrr..... Bit hard getting any response from "the Oliver list" these
days... It's dead.... NOBODY participates any more. Been replaced
by u2ug.org.....

BTW, have you tried to garner any interest in u2users.google by
mentioning its presence on u2ug? I can't find any mention of it
there.....

<Polite aside> the "ug" in "u2ug" probably stands for "users group" -
why do we need another such "user group"?<Polite aside/>

Quote:

The u2ug forums are somewhere between the two.

If you want to dig your heels in and refuse to go there - then that's
up to you. Stay away if you want to. I really don't see what useful
purpose you're serving though by advising me to shut it down, or
implying it's a waste of time and that, therefore, others should also
not participate. It's unhelpful and unconstructive criticism. Bud.

Mike.
Regards,

Bruce Nichol
Talon Computer Services
ALBURY NSW Australia

http://www.taloncs.com.au

If it ain't broke, fix it until it is....

#10

Bruce Nichol wrote:

Quote:

On 4 Jan 2006 18:11:42 -0800, "Mike Preece" <michael (AT) preece (DOT) net
wrote:

Tony Gravagno wrote:

[snip]

Regarding your post to the Google group: Respectfully my friend, the
only Google group that exists for U2/MV users is the one you created.
There are only 36 members there and you're mostly talking to yourself
in the few messages that have been posted - trees are falling and no
one is around to hear them. Hey, I understand the feeling from my own
unused website forums.

Do yourself a favor, delete the group and
take your requests to the u2users forum supported by U2UG.org. I'm
sure you'll get considered responses from a large and dedicated
community.

HTH
T

There's one thing and one thing only wrong with the u2users google
group : no one participates.

There's one thing and one thing only that the Oliver list has to its
advantage : many people participate.

Errrr..... Bit hard getting any response from "the Oliver list" these
days... It's dead.... NOBODY participates any more. Been replaced
by u2ug.org.....

Well it sure would be good if the 50 or so posts to the Oliver list in
the past couple of days - including a couple of yours - had been to the
u2users google group instead . Then, if someone wanted to find Dick's
numeric to alpha number conversion code in time to come - for instance
- they'd have a much better chance of finding it by googling u2users
than using the Oliver archive search. Don'cha reckon?

Mike.

Quote:

BTW, have you tried to garner any interest in u2users.google by
mentioning its presence on u2ug? I can't find any mention of it
there.....

Polite aside> the "ug" in "u2ug" probably stands for "users group" -
why do we need another such "user group"?<Polite aside/

The u2ug forums are somewhere between the two.

If you want to dig your heels in and refuse to go there - then that's
up to you. Stay away if you want to. I really don't see what useful
purpose you're serving though by advising me to shut it down, or
implying it's a waste of time and that, therefore, others should also
not participate. It's unhelpful and unconstructive criticism. Bud.

Mike.
Regards,

Bruce Nichol
Talon Computer Services
ALBURY NSW Australia

http://www.taloncs.com.au

If it ain't broke, fix it until it is....