We have some medium sized IngresII 2.5 databases with ABF
applications, still running on Reliant UNIX 5.43. We need to migrate
to some supported software on modern hardware, such as Oracle on
AIX.

Is anyone aware of migration tools to achieve this that would still
work with such an old unsupported version of Ingres? Where might one
obtain these tools from and roughly what sort of cost would be
involved?

Collectively we have experience of Ingres and of Oracle, but not of
migrating from one to the other. I am aware of the Ingres unloaddb
utility for example. Has anyone any experience of a similar migration
that could offer us any tips?

Many thanks,

L Jackson.

On Apr 20, 5:32*pm, spammeilov... (AT) googlemail (DOT) com wrote:
yes, your migration will take 3x as long as you think it will ;-)

On Apr 20, 2009, at 11:32 AM, spammeiloveit (AT) googlemail (DOT) com wrote:

If you were asking for help in migrating to a current version
of Ingres on modern hardware, you might get some love here;
but I personally don't have a lot of interest in helping
people migrate away from Ingres! Have you tried an Oracle
forum?

Karl

spammeiloveit (AT) googlemail (DOT) com wrote:

Moving your database won't be that hard. There's a myriad tools to do
that, more or less. I'd expect that part to take on the order of days
at most.

Moving your apps is much more of a project. Unless there is a very good
reason not to, you'd be quicker, cheaper, and less risky to just update
the infrastructure. Even doing a radical-sounding upgrade like Ingres
6.4 and ABF on VAX/VMS to Ingres 2006 on Windows with ABF on
client PCs is really quite simple and quick (and we've got the
references to prove it).

So is the problem the stale DBMS and hardware, or is the problem that
you don't want to run ABF?

--
Roy

UK Ingres User Association Conference 2009 will be on Tuesday June 9, 2009
Go to http://www.iua.org.uk/join to get on the mailing list.

--
Jean-Pierre Zuate
La Fage Conseil
+33(0)6 11 40 11 09
jean-pierre.zuate (AT) lafageconseil (DOT) fr
http://lafageconseil.fr/


2009/4/20 Karl & Betty Schendel <schendel (AT) kbcomputer (DOT) com>

On Apr 20, 11:32*am, spammeilov... (AT) googlemail (DOT) com wrote:
Uh....you do realize that newer versions of ingres are "supported"
right? And migration of the app to that would be straightforward.

As far as data, I guess its gonna depend on the underlying hardware,
of which you haven't spoken. For example, you might run into "endian"
issues, but those can be mitigated by dumping in character format.

One might pose that to an Oracle newsgroup. I doubt that you find
much here (except maybe converting *from* Oracle *to* ingres)

Such conversion projects are always costly, and generally more than
you expect. I've very limited experience w/ oracle, but I would think
you would be looking at re-writing the app in its entirety, and that
process would take somebody fairly familiar w/ both products

Why not upgrade Ingres 2.5 to Ingres 9.2 and ABF to OpenROAD? Ingres is
open source and can be built/run on *any* platform.

If you are committed to a move to Oracle, I can recommend Enterprise Access
for Oracle.
We used EA/Oracle to integrate / replace a large Oracle based 24x7
manufacturing / warehousing / distribution system with Ingres/OpenROAD and
practically no downtime. The Oracle database were synchronized with Ingres
via EA/Oracle over a WAN in real time and also via message queues. We were
able to phase in modules and business areas gradually over time running both
old and new systems simultaneously. The Oracle warehouse and manufacturing
data was maintained intact with Order Entry in Melbourne, factory and PLCs
in Sydney and SAP back end based in Singapore. By the way Melbourne was
Ingres on Solaris, EA/MSSQL and OpenROAD on Windows, Oracle was in Sydney on
unix something or other um who cares it just worked. End to end the project
took 3 months with significant application redesign. - and no down time.

Ingres also supports a bulk unload of data in a similar way to Oracle,
though I doubt you will find this option attractive. Too much risk to the
business. The copy statement is what you are looking for. It provides tab
(or any other) delimited text format which will be portable. Watch for
date/time and floating point conversions. Also pay attention to language /
character set conversions.


Conversion from ABF to OpenROAD is reasonably straight forward. There is a
recipe to follow. In my experience it can be done in about a day per screen.
ie A medium sized application of say 100 frames can be converted in about
100 man days. Your labor costs are going to depend on where you get the work
done. I recommend go with someone who can demonstrate a past successful
conversion. Alternatively, you may prefer a bulk ABF code conversions to
bring your apps into the 21st century without having to re-write critical
business logic. Remember the business logic is the most valuable part.


There are many capable organizations out there who can show you the way.
Check out links at http://www.ingres.com/partners/partner-directory.php

For good value Programming and Database conversion work (Australia and Sri
Lanka) I can highly recommend the services of
http://www.peercore.com.au/default.htm


Paul White

&
Shift Seven Solutions


-----Original Message-----
From: info-ingres-bounces (AT) kettleriver...ting (DOT) com
[mailto:info-ingres-bounces (AT) kettleriverconsulting (DOT) com] On Behalf Of
spammeiloveit (AT) googlemail (DOT) com
Sent: Tuesday, 21 April 2009 1:32 AM
To: info-ingres (AT) kettleriverconsulting (DOT) com
Subject: [Info-Ingres] Migration tools for moving IngresII 2.5 data and ABF
to Oracle

We have some medium sized IngresII 2.5 databases with ABF
applications, still running on Reliant UNIX 5.43. We need to migrate
to some supported software on modern hardware, such as Oracle on
AIX.

Is anyone aware of migration tools to achieve this that would still
work with such an old unsupported version of Ingres? Where might one
obtain these tools from and roughly what sort of cost would be
involved?

Collectively we have experience of Ingres and of Oracle, but not of
migrating from one to the other. I am aware of the Ingres unloaddb
utility for example. Has anyone any experience of a similar migration
that could offer us any tips?

Many thanks,

L Jackson.

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