"The inferior MySQL"

That seems to be the common implication on the ingres newsgroup - I'm not
quite sure why.

<http://thedutras.blogspot.com/2007/02/but-mysql-sucks.html>

***
Mark R. Winston
***


On Web wrote:

On Web wrote:

I'm pretty sure it's because this is a group mostly of self-selected
Ingres advocates. The group of self-selected MySQL advocates is called
comp.databases.mysql.

--
Roy

UK Ingres User Association Conference 2009 will be on Tuesday June 9, 2009
Go to http://www.iua.org.uk/join to get on the mailing list.

Mark R. Winston wrote:

There are certainly applications for which MySQL would be wholly
unsuitable, but there are also applications for which Ingres is wholly
unsuitable (or DB2, or any other arbitrary product).

I don't actually have a problem with MySQL as such. I have a problem
with anyone who thinks it is ideal, always, everywhere. Or even ideal
in a specific case when it isn't. Or thinks Ingres has no place that
MySQL wouldn't be a better choice.

I hope that if I were to thrust Ingres forward for some application it
isn't suited to and seemed unaware of the reasons why, that someone
would take the time to tell me. I might not like it, and I might not
give in right away, but if they're right I am pretty sure I'd get it
eventually. They better make a good case though. Time-wasting
boneheads need not apply.

--
Roy

UK Ingres User Association Conference 2009 will be on Tuesday June 9, 2009
Go to http://www.iua.org.uk/join to get on the mailing list.

"Roy Hann" <specially (AT) processed (DOT) almost.meat> wrote

I only put the thread forward because of the MySQL banter that appears on
the newsgroup.

Whatever the pros and cons of MySQL as a database, there is one thing where
I would say that MySQL is doing well in relation to ingres - market
penetration. I think that ingres could learn a lot from studying what has
made MySQL such a successful product.

I'm not sure how MySQL compares with ingres in terms of revenue, but I
suspect that MySQL is successful in markets where ingres really isn't to be
seen, while I suspect the opposite could also be true. My perception (it may
be wrong) is that ingres main revenue comes from introvert corporate and
goverment clients who are very conservative in their buying policies and
have a lot of inertia in their technology choices. I would contrast that
with my perception that MySQL is popular in emerging technology companies
and startups looking to engage with the wider world and the consumer.

I'd really like to see ingres move towards the markets that MySQL inhabits.
Is it making any inroads at all? What lessons can ingres learn apart from
the "me too" opensource initiative?

I have yet to see a web hosting provider offering ingres as an option.

Paul

as roy noted, I wouldn't expect a great number of MySql adherents in a
basically dedicated Ingres forum.

As to the breadth of MySqls adoption, you might peruse
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LAMP_(software_bundle)

I recall browsing thru "Linux Journal" (or was it??) a couple of years
back and seeing an article touting the virtues of "views" and the
breathless discussion of this "recently implemented" feature....as if
they'd just come up with it on there own and it was unique in the
world.

On Web wrote:

I had a meeting with Ketan Karia (SVP of Field Marketing) last spring in
which he disclosed actual figures. Ingres made *significantly* more
revenue than MySQL that year. Ingres tends to be used only in
bet-the-business situations so practically all Ingres users have paid
support.

--
Roy

UK Ingres User Association Conference 2009 will be on Tuesday June 9, 2009
Go to http://www.iua.org.uk/join to get on the mailing list.

"Roy Hann" <specially (AT) processed (DOT) almost.meat> wrote

That's interesting. Having downloaded both ingres and MySQL I can say that
MySQL is far more agressive in it's customer/potential customer
communications than ingres.com. I get no end of invites to web and actual
seminars (to explain how MySQL will make my life easy).

Invites from ingres.com are comparatively rare and from the openroad
community sometimes after the event!

Paul

Roy Hann wrote:
[not directed at you Roy]

I actually think that comparing MySQL to INGRES is very much an "apples
to oranges" comparison, at best. As Roy said, it's about the
application of a technology to solve a particular problem or a set of
problems. MySQL's strategy, from a technology and business perspective,
is utterly different from INGRES. Note that I refer to INGRES and not
"Ingres", or "Ingres Corp", etc., both for correctness and for the
history that I don't have to explain to this group, certainly. I think
it's an important distinction because INGRES has been poorly managed by
several owners, and it remains to be seen whether or not it can be
developed, from a business perspective, into something with a broader
installation base, but it certainly has never been, nor is it now,
because of a lack of technical functions and features. Oracle, DB2,
Sybase, MSSQL Server, Postgres, and even the new Vertica, all have
limitations and are better suited towards one problem set or another.
Show me something that's "lacking" in INGRES and I'll find a gap in any
of the aforementioned.

As has already been mentioned, this is an INGRES forum, so those of us
who subscribe and comment are *fans* of INGRES, which means that while
there are certain things we dislike, and things from other DBMS
technologies that we acknowledge as favorable, we have a preference
towards INGRES, which as with any preference, causes a skew where a
decision need be made. I'm currently spending all of my time developing
with MSSQL Server but I still work with INGRES and use it to solve
problems. Why? Because I "grew up" on INGRES, so to speak, and I like
it. So there.

This discussion could perpetuate indefinitely, but I think that the
criticisms of competing DBMS technologies are mostly fair, that amongst
the raucous about eating endangered animals, and various (subtle?) lewd
remarks

Now that the unofficial "race to acquisition" has been won by MySQL AB,
and DATAllegro has joined the Evil Empire (just kidding Karl ), maybe
INGRES can get back to evolving, steadily, and in-line with its
customers requirements? Too practical? Alright, back to the dirty jokes.

***
Mark R. Winston
***

On Jan 14, 7:47*pm, "Mark R. Winston" <winsto... (AT) datavailable (DOT) com>
wrote:
surely the "business perspective" is to get people using your
product ?!