http://www.informixcity.com/news6.aspx

I am bit anxious to know the legality of this
result. Doesn't oracle have a EUA about publishing
benchmark results without their written approval.

Data Cruncher wrote:
Correct.

A read of the PDFs shows two things.

1. The kernel parameters were not set per Oracle's docs.

2. No source code for the test and as everyone knows a
decent developer can manufacture any result they want
by using the most or least efficient method of
accomplishing a task.

It is so lame I expect Oracle will just ignore it.
I know I will.
--
Daniel A. Morgan
University of Washington
damorgan@x.washington.edu (replace x with u to respond)

DA Morgan said:
Which PDF was that, Daniel? The only PDFs I could see referred to
Informix-only "benchmarks". They appear to be entirely unrelated to the
main article.

As far as I can tell, Oracle won't even install if you don't set the
kernel up as per the release notes, so this is a spurious bit of
misdirection on your part.

Just for the sake of the argument, Daniel, given that document talks about
TPS, how would you feel if the benchmark used was a TPC-A or TPC-B style,
bog-standard, clearly defined application? One where there was no real
variation possible, or where they might have used a reference application?
IF THAT WERE THE CASE, would you feel that this comment might also be null
and void?

But having said all that, like Daniel, I fear that this "benchmark" does
nothing to substantiate the claims made and it would be lovely if the
world was allowed to see the raw facts.

I really wish IBM would stump up for a proper fully-audited benchmark.

Just out of interest, Daniel, what's your personal best time for
installing Oracle, given a raw, basic Unix box with nothing else loaded?
The whole enchilada?

Or don't you do installs? If not, what's the best time you've ever seen?

--
Bye now,
Obnoxio

"I'm astonished anyone pays real money for this crap."
-- Cosmo

--
This message has been scanned for viruses and
dangerous content by OpenProtect(http://www.openprotect.com), and is
believed to be clean.

"DA Morgan" <damorgan (AT) psoug (DOT) org> wrote

may be true, but how good is Oracle vis-as-vis Informix,
I see it daily at my company.

To give a simple example, top command shows Oracle
processes right at top where as Informix oninit process
somewhere at the bottom, with db2 somewhere in
the middle. Sometimes I wonder whether Informix
is doing anything :-)

This is at our development box where all three are installed
and used.

On 17 Jun, 19:52, DA Morgan <damor... (AT) psoug (DOT) org> wrote:
Your post is lame, which kernel parameter did not match which Oracle
doc?

On 17 Jun, 19:10, "Data Cruncher" <dcrunch... (AT) aim (DOT) com> wrote:

I always wanted to publish benchmarks but Oracle EULA stopped me.

In my view this is typically Oracle bollocks, they claim Oracle is the
best and yet are allowed to gag those who may have evidence that
contests this.

If there EULA legal? Can they gag people like this?

Data Cruncher wrote:
There are all sorts of interesting restrictions in Oracle licenses.
No doubt they will eventually be tested. And doing so can backfire:
http://antivirus.about.com/library/weekly/aa012003b.htm

Here is one that should give pause
http://www.oracle.com/html/terms.html
"the Documents may be used solely for personal, informational,
non-commercial purposes"

Every Oracle DBA logging onto the website stands with one food in jail...

Cheers
Serge

--
Serge Rielau
DB2 Solutions Development
IBM Toronto Lab

<david (AT) smooth1 (DOT) co.uk> wrote


You are not the first person to say this and I have seen myself
how Informix beats Oracle hands down.

Did you hear the case of a wall street bank was accosted by
Oracle (after they bought timesten database) that they should
convert their Informix application to Times10. Well they did
for testing. What happened???. Informix was 2-3x times faster
than 'in-memory' Times10 database. LoL. Oracle sales
went back to their hole with tail between their legs.

No wonder some of the most demanding OLTP applications in
the world runs on Informix. Like every Visa transaction in
US goes thru an Informix server.

<david (AT) smooth1 (DOT) co.uk> wrote

The last time I took Oracle 10 training, the guy sitting next to me
from Verizon Wireless told me that they datawarehouse application
runs on SQL Server. Every year, like sessional allergies,
Oracle pimps at Verizon
start asking question "why are we using sequal server, we should
try Oracle". But the DW folks are smarter than them. They have
a canned queries when they run on two identitical databases
(after allowing the oracle one to be 'fine tuned' by Oracle experts).
Result: SS beats Oracle all the time and my friends colleagues
tell them "Ok. this is your lesson for this year. see ya next year".

I have to play DA here.

I've put some time in with Orrible. It's not a bad database. Better at
some things, not as good at others. I can understand the EULA and have not
challenged it - recognizing that my Orrible knowledge is only good, not
great. If you let just anybody benchmark your software against another
package, then the resultant benchmark will be a product of that persons
knowledge of the two products. How would Most Obie Wan feel if Some Random
DBMS were compared to Informix and the tester chose not to update statistics
for the Informix DB? I imagine h(w)e might poke a finger at the results and
cry fowl. When some Database Agnostic type, with equivalent experience in
both DBs is allowed to benchmark the two (or 7) databases against one
another - with tests designed to highlight each databases strength, then it
might be interesting to see the results. No dis-respect meant to
Bell-Micro, I will read their results with interest.

Purportedly this is the point of the TPC benchmarks - a standard benchmark
in which all parties have a say, so the strengths of each should be
displayed - and yet when it boils down, we are presented with meaningless
TP/? numbers which measure the systems ability to execute the benchmark and
are totally useless in the real world.

j.

-----Original Message-----
From: informix-list-bounces (AT) iiug (DOT) org
[mailto:informix-list-bounces (AT) iiug (DOT) org]On Behalf Of Data Cruncher
Sent: Sunday, June 17, 2007 7:23 PM
To: informix-list (AT) iiug (DOT) org
Subject: Re: Informix beats Oracle



<david (AT) smooth1 (DOT) co.uk> wrote

The last time I took Oracle 10 training, the guy sitting next to me
from Verizon Wireless told me that they datawarehouse application
runs on SQL Server. Every year, like sessional allergies,
Oracle pimps at Verizon
start asking question "why are we using sequal server, we should
try Oracle". But the DW folks are smarter than them. They have
a canned queries when they run on two identitical databases
(after allowing the oracle one to be 'fine tuned' by Oracle experts).
Result: SS beats Oracle all the time and my friends colleagues
tell them "Ok. this is your lesson for this year. see ya next year".




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